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Post by youxia on Jun 20, 2012 17:59:24 GMT -5
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lei_taiI reccomend reading this, it shows that Kung fu does actually have a history of sparring. Also some people die and a guy gets his guts ripped out... (Most interesting bits in my opinion are towards end of history section and national boxing competitions section)
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Post by jwbulldogs on Jun 20, 2012 18:50:10 GMT -5
Hmmm...not sure why this is posted in the traditional section. There is another section for miscellaneous.
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Post by youxia on Jun 20, 2012 19:00:07 GMT -5
Because it's about people fighting with traditional martial arts?
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Keyboard Warrior
Head Administrator
Ze Führer
Brazilian Jiu Jitsu Practitioner
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Post by Keyboard Warrior on Jun 20, 2012 21:29:04 GMT -5
I think it counts as traditional. I don't see why it wouldn't? Unless JW is seeing something I'm not.
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Post by laoshi on Jun 20, 2012 23:28:28 GMT -5
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kane
White Belt
Posts: 24
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Post by kane on Jun 21, 2012 1:07:52 GMT -5
This is related to traditional martial arts....because it's kung fu.
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Post by gunter on Jun 21, 2012 7:42:05 GMT -5
@bandito. Great youtube clip! I love that film.
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Post by jwbulldogs on Jun 21, 2012 10:30:13 GMT -5
Traditional martial have always been associated with mysticism. People often assume that because you are a martial artist you can accomplish great thing that defy the laws of gravity and physic. They also associate magic with TMA. These things are myths.
In my limited 20 plus years of training I have yet to learn or meet anyone who claim they can rip out someone intestines. This is not martial arts let alone TMA. It is a myth. it is a fallacy that give true martial artist a bad name.
Ripping out a guys intestines might belong in the fiction section.
Persona example of myths associated with martial arts.
I was teen and had been training. One summer I went to LA to visit my father. My little brother had lived there about a year. He was big for his age and I've always been small for my age. Over the course of that year the older kids would bully him. He didn't fight back. I didn't know about this. He knew I was coming and told them about me training. I get there and meet some of the locals. They were being extremely nice to my brother. One guy asked me about my martial arts. Then he asked if he could punch me in the stomach. I was puzzled, but then I saw an image in my head of Bruce Lee's 6 pack. I didn't have a 6 pack but I was solid. So I said sure and he hit me as hard as he could. I tighten up like I was trained to do. He hurt his hand. Next thing I know he was telling everyone that yeah he does know martial arts. All of that because I can take a punch in the stomach. Later after I became friends with a few they old me they feel sorry for my brother. They told me how those guys who were being nice to him now were the same guys and gang members that picked on him. They knew they would pick on him more when I was gone. So I asked my brother about this and he confirmed their story. I was young and dumb (book smart) but did something foolish. I came out in the middle of the street and called them all out. I threatened them all and told them that I bet not hear about anyone bother him again or they would have to deal with me. I was greatly outnumbered, but they all say no one would bother him. I told them they better have his back and that I would be back soon. At the time I had plane to come back the next year to live and go to school there.
2nd example: Same summer. One guy who was a gang member (blood) and local bike thief. Bikes were big in Inglewood. Everyone had to have these $2500.00 bikes or more. If it didn't cost that much they wouldn't let you live it down. You would never ride that bike in public. Well this guy asked me about martial arts too. Then he went on to say you can't use that stuff in the streets. He was under the impression that we have to register as lethal weapons and would get in trouble for using martial arts. My response was I can use whatever I wanted to defend myself. From that day on he avoided me. We were never cool before that. I didn't trust him mainly because he was a thief. But we were at least cordial until then. I'm not sure why he avoided my after that. It might have something to do with m telling using him as an example of how I would use my training to hurt him in self defense if he ever got out of line. He might of thought that was a threat or something. I was just using it as an example. I wasn't threatening him, but I thought he wanted to test me, but he never did. I found out sometime after I left he got killed. I don't know why, but he probably got caught stealing from the wrong person.
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Post by youxia on Jun 21, 2012 11:57:33 GMT -5
I wouldnt neccessarily agree it's impossible, through rigourous training people can do amazing things. I'm not sure there is a limit to human potential. A lot of stuff in regards to mysticysm is bull, like people who claim they can kill with shouting or hurt you without touching you. Maybe I sound stupid for saying this, but I wouldn't consider that outside the realms of possibility, like there was that fight science episode where they showed it was possible to rip a mans throat out. Especially with the ridiculous grip training they did back then.
And in the events you described, it might not be a bad thing people think that. You were able to make life a lot easier for your brother with their preconcieved notions of martial arts. All you did was demonstrate one thing, and their imaginations did the rest. I've met people like that too, they seem to believe theres some kind of unbreakable law that you can only ever use martial arts in pure self defense.
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Chef Samurai
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Canadian Catch Wrestling
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Post by Chef Samurai on Jun 21, 2012 15:16:17 GMT -5
In china a lot of sanshou fight's are done on a le-tai too www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bfdabj06SU&t=0m31s@jw- wait until I get a pig carcass to start working my finger jabs on like the ancient greeks did and then I'll be able to tell you because if I can rip through it I can do it to a person and some people can do it to coconuts with their fingers that are a lot harder than human flash. www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViI5mNHGKWwclothing would be another variable though
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Post by jwbulldogs on Jun 21, 2012 16:50:19 GMT -5
JKD, please post the video of you and the pig carcass. LOL Document day 1 until your final conclusion.
Yes, I'm glad today that they just assumed that I was something special because I had been training. Especially since I was outnumbered. My training against multiple attackers at that time was theory only. I hadn't actually had to do it against live people. Since then I have. But no you are not going to rip out a persons intestines. There is too much muscle and connective tissue for that to happen.
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Chef Samurai
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Canadian Catch Wrestling
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Post by Chef Samurai on Jun 21, 2012 17:21:42 GMT -5
Yeah a documentary sounds like a good idea but my conditioning is still a few years away lol
and it's all about psi and if you can concentrate enough psi into a target without breaking what your hitting with it you can go through it and apparently the greeks favorite place was the armpit with a spear hand or finger jab or whatever you want to call it and it's simple physics really.
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Post by jwbulldogs on Jun 21, 2012 18:02:55 GMT -5
It is more than psi in this case. If it were a hard substance like bone, brick, concrete or even your coconuts then psi would apply. But you are talking about muscle and other connective tissue that expands and contracts. Meaning it pliable. It doesn't just break. It has to be cut or torn. That will not happen from a strike.
Not only do the Greeks like the armpit so do we in shorin ryu. If you tried to punch me I can easily use a knife hand strike to the armpit or to the joint between the blade of the shoulder and arm. I don't need to use any strength. But the harder you hit the more you will hurt.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Jun 21, 2012 18:29:30 GMT -5
Well that's like saying you can't be impaled by a metal bar. The only thing is the average persons fingers will break but once strong enough they can withstand the impact and you generate enough force to impale someone with a metal bar you should be able to do it with your fingers. According to physics not only is it plausible but it's probable and apparently the greeks used to rip each others hearts through the left armpit with a spear hand thrust because yu can go over the rib cage instead of having to break through it..
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Post by jwbulldogs on Jun 22, 2012 2:14:34 GMT -5
Oh no. hat is quite different than using and object to pierce the skin. the density of that object along with the right amount of force make that possible.
There is no reliable records that is documented that has the Greek ripping out each other hearts out with their bare hands through the arm pit. LOL
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