odee
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Kyokushin 10 years - Brazilian Jujitsu 3 years - Muay Thai 2 years.
Posts: 1,286
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Post by odee on Nov 21, 2012 16:26:41 GMT -5
One of the most common arguments I hear regarding any given style is effectiveness. This makes me rather curious about a number of things, especially on the technique level.
How much stock do you actually put in the technique side of your martial art? What makes it better suited to you? Do you believe people put a proper effort into each technique when they run by Bruce Lee's 'Take what works and ditch what doesn't' motto? How much work do you put into making a technique work and how do you go about it? How do you go about getting as much as you can out of your forms/poomsei/kata/shadowboxing?
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Post by Glutton4Punishment on Nov 22, 2012 19:17:03 GMT -5
I do what I can to force myself to make a technique work. When I first started Muay Thai, I picked up Te Tut very slowly. To remedy this, I started working my butt off doing nothing but Te Tut kicks constantly until I couldn't kick anymore. With enough repetitions, muscle memory will kick in and help you make a technique work. That's how I did it. I've got a pretty nice Te Tut at this point, I think.
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Chef Samurai
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Canadian Catch Wrestling
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Post by Chef Samurai on Nov 22, 2012 19:55:59 GMT -5
I do what works & I always work on a technique but there might be an easier way of doing it for me because my build could be different than who I learned it from even if it's there favorite move.
Body mechanics play a huge role on what works with who because some techniques rely on you being smaller than your opponent or bigger or whatever to work.
I know it's hard for me to pull of a seoi nage without dropping to my knees against a shorter opponent & same with uppercuts.
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odee
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Kyokushin 10 years - Brazilian Jujitsu 3 years - Muay Thai 2 years.
Posts: 1,286
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Post by odee on Nov 22, 2012 23:20:36 GMT -5
Glutton I always struggle with Thai. Te Tut is a roundhouse kick, are you talking about the motion itself or particularly the head kick? By putting stock in technique I mean like when we both said Wing Chun is bad teaching, me because most schools have minimal sparring and bad attitudes, you said it was a technical flaw, I was hoping for more elaboration on that.
Chef Try being 6'1 and built like a basketballer. How far do you think you can modify a technique before it becomes something else entirely? I read a post on Bullshido where people were discussing the difference between Kyokushin and Muay Thai kicks. Honestly I thought both sides were talking out their asses until one guy said:
The techniques are virtually identical. Watch as noted Kyokushin champ Ayato Kitajima demonstrates a kick.
Is he doing a Kyokushin or a Muay Thai kick?
The answer is "Yes"
Why? They're the same damn kick. You'd find more difference in technique if you looked through all the top guys in a single school than the minute details most of these guys were arguing about, I'd be willing to bet that if most of the posters did twenty kicks there would be more variation within those twenty kicks than the differences they were arguing. That's why I'm asking about the stock people put in technique.
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Chef Samurai
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Canadian Catch Wrestling
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Post by Chef Samurai on Nov 22, 2012 23:43:59 GMT -5
it depends that's always an addition to the original technique.
like eddy bravos twister is a modified guillotine bu it's still bjj & same with the peruvian necktie are all modified from an original source but they are just additions to whatever because they worked.
I'm trying to modify some pro wrestling moves to add to my arsenal but it's hard work but in the end I end up with decent middle percentage moves at least and even some high percentage ones like the ddt that's illegal in most rules but man would it kill if it was used on pavement and not padding.
Also A LOT of people forget that knowing how to do a move great technically & being able to execute a correct move correctly.
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odee
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Kyokushin 10 years - Brazilian Jujitsu 3 years - Muay Thai 2 years.
Posts: 1,286
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Post by odee on Nov 23, 2012 0:11:39 GMT -5
Aside from a feint what do you call a move when it doesn't connect with anything?
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odee
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Kyokushin 10 years - Brazilian Jujitsu 3 years - Muay Thai 2 years.
Posts: 1,286
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Post by odee on Nov 23, 2012 0:30:40 GMT -5
I can still remember trying to pull off the 'Twist of fate' in the Karate dojo. I damn near dislocated my shoulder with my opponent's jaw. I think my teacher was the one who hurt the most, he laughed so hard I thought he'd split.
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Post by Glutton4Punishment on Nov 23, 2012 2:19:17 GMT -5
First of all, no they are not the exact same kick. They are quite similar, especially since Oyama implemented using the shin as a striking surface, but the difference is in the chambering. Karateka chamber their kicks. The knee is the fulcrum. Muay Thai fighters do not. It's a subtle looking difference, but it changes the kick nonetheless.
And Te Tut is not just a roundhouse kick. It's a "Cut Kick". It's the directly horizontal swinging kick of Muay Thai. Not to be confused with Te Yang/Chiang, the upward roundhouse kick, or Te Kad which rises and then strikes downward. Each kick has it's own dynamic and should be thought of as a separate Muay Thai strike, not variations of the same (even though they essentially are).
I could always do Te Yang, the upward diagonal kick, with no problems. This is because the movement of the hip is different than Te Tut, even though the kicks are VERY similar. The movement of the hip in a powerful Te Yang falls somewhere between a straight knee and a cut kick. Since I've always found straight knees and Teeps very comfortable, Te Yang worked better for me than Te Tut.
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Chef Samurai
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Canadian Catch Wrestling
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Post by Chef Samurai on Nov 23, 2012 2:27:21 GMT -5
odee- lol well there is obvious stupid shit that wont work like that or a stunner... slamming a hard part of your opponent against a soft part of yourself isn't so smart and I mostly meant subs but a lot of stuff is used for counters because your positioning is awkward sometimes & you can pull of weird shit from my experience.
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odee
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Kyokushin 10 years - Brazilian Jujitsu 3 years - Muay Thai 2 years.
Posts: 1,286
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Post by odee on Nov 23, 2012 17:30:04 GMT -5
Like I said Glutton, I struggle with Thai language. To me those kicks are Gedan Mawashigeri - thigh roundhouse kick Chudan Mawashigeri - torso roundhouse kick Jodan Mawashigeri - head roundhouse kick Chambering the kick isn't a necessity it's a preference. He chambers for power because he's a light quick guy. I don't chamber because I've already got plenty of power, my weak area is speed. I've noticed the same is true of the Muay Thai students I currently train with, some chamber, some don't.
Chef. It seemed like a good idea at the time, I got it into my head that it would work something like an uppercut because while I was playing rugby my shoulder charge was one of my most destructive moves. I just didn't consider that the impact was pushing the shoulder down from the socket rather than into it and since there was less impact it was worse for me than the other guy.
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