Post by aaronj on Jul 12, 2012 21:25:06 GMT -5
This is a great topic for debate, but the issue that must be laid out is what is classified as traditional, and what is classified as modern. I thought that was mentioned somewhere here already by KW. Now that may be a generalization of this particular forum's rules, to better govern topic categorization, but it is something that would have to be constantly evolving, as we will not only have to convince each other of our opinions (which this is exactly what it would be based on the topics showing up as rule separators), and even changing our own opinions from the influence of others.
All martial practices in my opinion which teach fully spontaneous sparring are modern, because you must learn all aspects you can in order to be constantly improving, in order to ensure the best chances of survival.... I'll be back with more, going to a movie!!
OK sorry for the delay...
Tradition is defined by Webster's Dictionary as:
1
a : an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b : a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2
: the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3
: cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4
: characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>
So, going by these variations we should be able to say everything discussed here is traditional. Now whether it's a sport or not, should also be rather simply laid out. If you do it in a ring with rules and get paid, or get a trophy, then it is a sport. If you do it for personal protection (whether good or bad, karate or mma) then it is not a sport. If you do both, then you do both, and nobody can say, that fighting sports will not work in self defense situations, because they can and often do. It's in the news fairly often that somebody who was a pugilist survived an attack or aided a victim with their learned skills.
There is too much classification and detail oriented pigeonholing of the various martial arts the world over.
There are thousands of different systems of study with both similarities and differences, even falling under the same umbrella. These varieties are too many to try and categorize each and every one. Also, just because something doesn't work for one person, does not mean it is bad.
On to the next subject. Toudi was the original name of the Okinawan fighting arts, and the ideogram was for the Tang Dynasty(600's-900's), and later became known to symbolize China itself. Funakoshi wasn't the one to change the ideogram of the "Chinese" hand to the "Empty" hand. The first record of this was done by Itosu's direct student Hanashiro Chomo in a 1905 publication.
Karate came from Okinawa, blended with Chinese martial arts, and ultimately those of Japan (more in the recent centuries). Secrets were always there, and are more rapidly becoming exposed, and passed along with the breaking of cultural barriers.
There was a lot that was changed when karate spread to Japan. Much of it stemmed from those wanting to teach karate in schools as a physical education program (thus the pinan kata). There was a more regimented training system created, which was different from the way Funakoshi was taught... and should be taken into account. Funakoshi didn't learn Shotokan, Shotokan was created through him.
Anyway, hope this helps some.
All martial practices in my opinion which teach fully spontaneous sparring are modern, because you must learn all aspects you can in order to be constantly improving, in order to ensure the best chances of survival.... I'll be back with more, going to a movie!!
OK sorry for the delay...
Tradition is defined by Webster's Dictionary as:
1
a : an inherited, established, or customary pattern of thought, action, or behavior (as a religious practice or a social custom) b : a belief or story or a body of beliefs or stories relating to the past that are commonly accepted as historical though not verifiable
2
: the handing down of information, beliefs, and customs by word of mouth or by example from one generation to another without written instruction
3
: cultural continuity in social attitudes, customs, and institutions
4
: characteristic manner, method, or style <in the best liberal tradition>
So, going by these variations we should be able to say everything discussed here is traditional. Now whether it's a sport or not, should also be rather simply laid out. If you do it in a ring with rules and get paid, or get a trophy, then it is a sport. If you do it for personal protection (whether good or bad, karate or mma) then it is not a sport. If you do both, then you do both, and nobody can say, that fighting sports will not work in self defense situations, because they can and often do. It's in the news fairly often that somebody who was a pugilist survived an attack or aided a victim with their learned skills.
There is too much classification and detail oriented pigeonholing of the various martial arts the world over.
There are thousands of different systems of study with both similarities and differences, even falling under the same umbrella. These varieties are too many to try and categorize each and every one. Also, just because something doesn't work for one person, does not mean it is bad.
On to the next subject. Toudi was the original name of the Okinawan fighting arts, and the ideogram was for the Tang Dynasty(600's-900's), and later became known to symbolize China itself. Funakoshi wasn't the one to change the ideogram of the "Chinese" hand to the "Empty" hand. The first record of this was done by Itosu's direct student Hanashiro Chomo in a 1905 publication.
Karate came from Okinawa, blended with Chinese martial arts, and ultimately those of Japan (more in the recent centuries). Secrets were always there, and are more rapidly becoming exposed, and passed along with the breaking of cultural barriers.
There was a lot that was changed when karate spread to Japan. Much of it stemmed from those wanting to teach karate in schools as a physical education program (thus the pinan kata). There was a more regimented training system created, which was different from the way Funakoshi was taught... and should be taken into account. Funakoshi didn't learn Shotokan, Shotokan was created through him.
Anyway, hope this helps some.