odee
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Post by odee on Dec 15, 2012 5:55:22 GMT -5
If he's doing what I think he's doing worm one hand in between his ribs/kidneys/side and his bicep then dig your thumb knuckle into his side, unless he's unbelievably straight about how he pushes the elbow down he should naturally pull his arms in for leverage and push your thumb-knuckle into his own side, then it's just a matter of outlasing him.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 15, 2012 6:06:55 GMT -5
I see what you mean & I'll have to give it a try because my only thought so far has been to go to open guard and sweep him but when I try I panic because my fat legs are getting murdered lol
I imagine if I get my thumb knuckle right in between 2 ribs and he pushes in he'll hurt bad.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 15, 2012 6:15:25 GMT -5
I've seen people do it the other way around and do the biscep but I've never pulled it off myself, the side is the easier target by a long shot.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 15, 2012 6:21:54 GMT -5
yeah the bicep seems more power based while he uses his own power to aid me in digging into his side.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 15, 2012 6:27:16 GMT -5
Nothing like letting someone else supply the effort for you.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 15, 2012 6:40:44 GMT -5
yep make someone else do it for you.
that's why I like judo because it's a main principle but watching an olympic match you;d never be able to tell.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 15, 2012 15:06:20 GMT -5
There is very little skill difference in olympic judo. That's when matches become based around athletisism.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 15, 2012 19:31:13 GMT -5
I see almost no yielding in judo in the olympics like the old Judo contests.
I see more acrobatics that require conditioning than I see Judo principles of
I think it's because the rules only allow certain things because judo is highly restricted and weight classes make it easier because everyone's the same size.
If you look at classical Judo they didn't have weight classes so when a smaller man fought a larger man he couldn't over power him so he had to learn how to yield and counter or get crushed.
My old Judo coach was a big proponent of going outside your weight class for that reason & apparently in japan he used to practice against sumoka to practice his yielding & counters because there was no way he could out muscle 300 lb sumoka.
And now everyone is in their own weight class and never have to take someone that much bigger than themselves so they don't learn yielding properly.
I'm pretty sure I've read stuff by jw that's simmilar & apparently he's a smaller guy who always practiced outside his weight and I bet is a great Judoka for it.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 16, 2012 4:37:50 GMT -5
There may be something to that argument. But I'll also say it's much harder to get underneath someone the same size as you or smaller. There should be an open competition to decide champion of champions. That's when you'd be seeing middleweight heroes.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 16, 2012 6:48:37 GMT -5
yes very true I noticed in judo I had to use my thighs, feet & knees more tricky to get people down because I have long legs.
I noticed a foot trick I like to use that works really good with shoes & still good without where you have your front foot outside their front foot touching toe to toe and then do a seionage & your hip can't get under theirs you'll trip them when their foot tries to move & can't.
maybe that's a bad description of it though & the whole point of judo is for a smaller person to be able to beat a bigger man using their principles of leverage.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 16, 2012 7:08:43 GMT -5
and they do have that here it's called submission wrestling or submission grappling or just grappling according to FILA.
it's basically where anyone from freestyle wrestling, greco-roman wrestling, american folkstyle wrestling, catch wrestling, judo, sambo, bjj or luta livre compete under rules similar to all the above.
Organizations like FILA & NAGGA are big here for that.
Basically old catch was the same thing with lancashire wrestlers adding cornish & devonshire throws and vice versa then adding japanese judo, indian koshti & iranian pelvhani moves & concepts to their repertoire to make themselves more complete & well rounded grapplers just like grapplers are doing today.
I wonder why the influence of judo is downplayed in modern wrestling & the influence of wrestling is downplayed in judo when if you read their history's it's obvious.
Even the terminology is the same like in wrestling the "jap whizzer" is just the same as judo's whizzer but judo does it with a gi & wrestling doesn't and in judo the term for fireman's carry isn't attested to in any other style of jujutsu and apparently came from wrestling and there's a few more thing's I can't remember from the top of my head.
Basically now that it's 2012 every popular style influenced every other one to some degree or another in the grappling world.
Sambo was influenced by judo, catch wrestling & olympic wrestling in the beginning among other styles.
BJJ was influenced by judo, catch & luta livre in the begining and rolls added olympic wrestling & sambo.
Judo was influenced by wrestling in the beginning & later Sambo in the 1970's and the rule changes at the time were designed to stop the russian fighters from dominating with their unorthodox gi grips & flying armbars they were the first to use.
Luta Livre was catch wrestling with olympic wrestling & judo added then later bjj was added by some.
Basically it's a whole great big cluster fv(k of bull$#!+ and they are all the same just different way's of doing it these days.
Now days I noticed bjj guys going no gi, sambo guys using chokes, wrestlers using guard, judo guys doing ne-waza etc. so there is more of an influence on each other than people let on because everyone's styles better than everyone else's & their master can whoop yours and whatever bs they wan;t to say.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 16, 2012 17:28:13 GMT -5
Pride. Nobody wants to admit that you can find a lot of the same in another school or style.
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Chef Samurai
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Post by Chef Samurai on Dec 18, 2012 4:42:30 GMT -5
wow I never thought of that... I always thought it was my style doesn't need that because we have this & it's better but I guess it could be both depending on the schools.
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odee
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Post by odee on Dec 20, 2012 17:01:53 GMT -5
Could be both, could be either, could be neither. Personally I like the fact that most martial arts are a cluster fv#k, it's part of what leads people to figure out that the guys who invented their styles were pretty open minded and learned from others.
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